[Music] Hi listeners, welcome back to the
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Lessons from the Playroom podcast. I have a returned guest with me, one of my
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personal favorite guests. I have um well, I’m going to tell you what we’re
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going to talk about first and then I’ll tell you who who I have. We’re actually going to talk about family constellation
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work, which we’ve never discussed on this podcast um series before. Uh and I
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have with me the amazing Millie Sarmento Shoemaker. Uh, for those of you that are
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not familiar with Millie, um, Millie and I um talked about aggression in a in a
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past podcast, but a different angle on aggression, more like what comes up,
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what happens when it’s the therapist, right? That’s having those aggressive um urges um inside. So, please make sure to
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go check that out. And we also did one on the concept of attachment to self. So
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Millie, I think you might be my only guest that I’ve had three times.
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We had another one around four times. Owning owning a client’s being our
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mirrors, folks. She’s back for the fourth time.
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That’s how much I love this person. I love conversations with you, Millie.
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But, uh, Millie, you’re in the hot seat, uh, today as, uh, as we introduce the idea of family constellation work to our
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audience. But, let me go ahead and, uh, refresh our listeners a little bit about
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you. Uh, you are a bilingual therapist, teacher, supervisor, originally from
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Argentina. Now you live in Colorado, fluent in Spanish and English. You specialize in cross-cultural and
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international work with a passion for child development, family dynamics, supporting those navigating multiple
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cultures. You’re also a certified synergetic play therapist, supervisor,
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trainer, the whole uh the whole works. Um driven by a deep love for humanity, uh Millie empowers individuals and
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families to face life challenges with resilience and authenticity. That is a fact. Uh she believes in the healing
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power of embracing one’s story, cultivating compassion within communities. You are a mama of two. I am
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married to one cool dude. Uh you love hiking, cooking, nurturing meaningful
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relationships. You’re just a rock star basically is what that.
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Okay. So Millie, some people may not even be familiar with the concept family constellation. So, if you can just
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introduce us to that and then then we’ll start to dive into a little bit about
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why you love the work and then how we can apply these principles in our thinking with kids and working with our
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clients. Beautiful. Yes. Um so today we’re going to talk a little bit about
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family consolation kind of like this um the basic concepts around this
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philosophy and then we’re going to bring it into the clinical work like how what you can bring even if you never study
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family consolation how you can bring this systemic lens into the work that we do with kids.
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So let’s start with just talking a little bit about Bert Helinger. It is. So family consolation is like SVT. It’s
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a live model, a philosophy. It’s not just a you know a method that you learn
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and you apply that it never changes. It will continue to evolve and change as
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long as we are in this planet in my opinion. So Bhelinger is the originator
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if you will. It’s going to be you Lisa in a 100 years. We’re going to talk about you, but SPT is going to right change and evolve and look a little bit
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different. So, Bur Helinger was a a German psychotherapist that originally
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was a priest. He was a Cathol Catholic priest for many years. Um, and then he
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left that to be a psychotherapist. He wanted to he was he lived in South
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Africa with the Sulu community for many, many years. And what he loved about that
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community was their respect and love for their ancestors. So when he left you know um
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the Catholic uh religion to be a psychotherapist he studied many modalities. So family consolation like
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SPT is influenced by many different modalities like
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psychoanalysis, gestal therapy, um systemic approach, um family therapy, um
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so so many you know even like the his spirituality like he when he left the um
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when he left being a priest, he took with him his spiritual uality, right?
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Like he didn’t there was a very important time in his life where he kind of like decided to leave that when he
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realized that what he put first wasn’t like what he what Bur Helinger put first
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in his work wasn’t the dogma wasn’t the ideas and what he put first was the
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people the relationships the the um what families and systems will bring into the
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space that he was in. So, he’s someone very wellknown and he’s
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a like those people that create amazing things in my opinion. You’re going to find people that love him and you’re
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going to find people that question him a lot. Um, so just know that he’s someone
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interesting. And what I want to talk about a little bit is kind of like the way that he looked
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at systems. And when we say systems, he specifically talks about
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family systems, but it’s not just family systems, right? Like systems is like we
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can think about like um for example, as therapist, right? As play therapist in
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the US, let’s just narrow down to the US. There is a system, right? There there is a system that we are part of.
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But in this conversation, we’re going to put the focus in family system. Okay? But these orders that I’m going to talk
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about applies to all systems. So what he noticed, what Burhelinger noticed is
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that in every system there are three basic labs, orders of lab he called
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them. The first one is belonging which this means everyone
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that has been part of the family system or that is part
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belongs everyone and every
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experience part of us right sometimes we tend to exclude to put aside that that
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we don’t like that that our animal brain right um doesn’t want because we’re not
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comfortable with that. But what he says is that many times in family systems
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there are symptoms that are being expressed because one so we’re going to talk about
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three orders. One of these three orders is not in place. So the first one is belonging, right? And we’re gonna make
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sense of this in the context of play therapy. Okay. The Can I just say something real quick? So you just um uh
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and this may be totally where you’re going um but when I was doing studying on intergenerational trauma and looking
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at the intergenerational patterns in families, one of the things that I kept
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reading and understanding was that anyone excluded in a family system from
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a prior whatever will show up again at some point in the system because the
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system will not alienate someone out of the system. Yes, you got it. Yeah, I
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love it. I love it so much. It’s like you you will belong. Yes, you will belong. And the system the system
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doesn’t judge. So the system has space has love if you will for everyone
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and everything. We tend to judge when we feel uncomfortable with certain
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experiences. Yeah. The purpose of when so yes when something has been excluded
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or someone has been excluded future generations will experience it will attract similar you know patterns so the
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system can love it can make for it this is so good and this is going to be so
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connected with play therapy so hang in there so the second order
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is hierarchy there is a an order where everyone in the family system has its
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own place. So this idea that there is a natural order based on time and roles. For
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example, merely I am a mother of two, right? I came before my
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kids. I have my own place in the family system as a mother in relationship to my
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kids. when that and we see a lot of this in therapy. We’re going to talk about
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parentified when I am not in my place of being a mother right to my two kids.
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This order is not being in placed and maybe some of my kids is trying to
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play out the mother role in my system. Therefore, we’re going to start to see
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symptoms that speak to this order. So we the family members can wake up and look
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at you know which is my place in my family system when you are in your place
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and you respect others places. So meaning respecting that my parents are
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my parents and they came before me and even if I don’t agree with the life that
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they created is their life there is power in that right and there is wisdom in that when I respect that I am in my
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place and when I’m in my place I’m in my power when I’m occupying someone else’s space
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I am not one with life I am stuck I’m not you know We get this
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a lot as therapists when we we have clients that are feeling stuck are they are feeling that they’re not inspired
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that they don’t have energy that they’re feeling depressed many times is because they’re not in their place in the family
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system and the next one is there is a balance between giving and taking. So the f exchange that the martini talks a
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lot about it. So in all in all relationships
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except the parents we’re going to talk about that there has to be a balance between giving and they even say giving
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and taking because the the giving and receiving the receiving is more passive
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right I’m receiving but the taking is like I’m taking what is mine. So when
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you think of relationships with with like with siblings with h partners when
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this bal when when this order is in place and there’s a balance between giving and taking the there’s a flow in
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the relationship when there is not in place this order then we start to see either that that person that is giving too much
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is feeling resentful right with parents from a family
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consolidation perspective um parents Kids cannot pay give back to parents
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what they have received because what we received from this perspective what what
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we have received as kids is life from our parents and
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life is something that you cannot pay back. The way that kids pay back to their parents or give back to their
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parents is by creating a meaningful life is by giving back to the to to the world
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to the society that they are a part of. Um, so these are the basic orders and
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what we’re going to talk about is how how we can make sense of this from a systemic lens with the clients that we
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work with. Yeah. So even in that last one, Millie, you can hear the under undertone of his
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spiritual belief system too, right? That was also brought brought in brought into that. That’s very cool. Yeah.
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And even these three orders also are applicable in the relationship that we
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therapists have with clients. So for us to get curious am I giving too
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much as a therapist? Am I giving what I don’t have to give? Am I not asking what what you know what
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is mine? Am I not am I not taking what is mine? So all of this, even though
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we’re going to talk in the context of how we work with families, but it’s also applicable in our in our relationship
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with the clients that we work with. Yeah. Okay. Where do you want to go with this?
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Well, what I’m just hearing, I know you I know you use the word fair exchange for that last principle, but I’m actually hearing that under like under
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all of them that this the system is seeking a certain order and the a
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certain balance certain balance. Yeah. a certain a certain kind of balance because the system’s in balance if I’m
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if I’m hearing you say like like look there’s certain roles in a family system they’re going to be filled by somebody
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whether they’re being filled in a particular order that’s a different question but they are going to be filled
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um you know and so yeah so this idea of the the system itself I love it is alive
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and it’s it’s trying to find its own balance its own equinimity its own every
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person within it is trying to find their their place within the order and the balance and the equinimity and that what
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I’m hearing is that and when when uh when they can’t when the system can’t
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then the s the system starts to show symptoms in order to try to catch the
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attention theoretically of the family members to wake up to am I getting this
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yes yes it’s usually the anc what from a family consolation per approach coach.
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We believe that our ancestors, so those that came before us,
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that something so when we think about trauma, right? Trauma is when something
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was too much for the nervous system and that we needed to leave information out
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in order to survive, right? So we know that our ancestors had trauma and many
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of those traumatic experience weren’t fully integrated because they were on survival mode. Mhm. So that is what is
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also passed on to future generations. The intragenerational you know trauma is passed on uh current generations and the
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intention of that is not because life is punishing us. If those ancestors are
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trying to be seen to be kind of like complete, if you will that that they
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didn’t have a chance to complete then. Yeah, that’s how I love to think of it too because I I do think well more and
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more people are talking about intergenerational trauma, but they I hear it talked about in sort of this yucky way like it’s this thing this this
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this yuck thing, this thing that was done to me and and the way I like to
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look at it is no, it’s it’s actually part of an offering. It’s actually, you know, in my generation, I experienced
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something that I perceived as challenging. I did the best I could with it. I couldn’t quite integrate it, but I
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also am going to hand down that information almost as a look, if you
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were to encounter the same situation. Here’s information that you might need or want for your survival. So, it’s also
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like a passing down of survival information, but also this sort of I couldn’t do this.
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could you help me so that the next generation helps helps the generations
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and we we just keep passing down that which we can’t integrate. Yes. Yeah.
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And from a family consolation perspective we each of us so let’s say for in each family system right there
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each individual we are entangled meaning we are we have this hidden connection with
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someone that came before us. And so let’s say I’m debating to share about my story
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because I don’t want to expose my dad but well can I share a funny story? Yes.
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Yes. So my mom has has passed away as you know. Well I mean I to me it’s these
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sort of interesting subtle pieces of there were aspects and qualities about
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my mother that I wouldn’t say that the rest of the family found to be the most
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pleasant. We’ll just put it like that, right? They were activating. They were They’re
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right. They were activating, right? They were activating. Well, connected to her connected to connected to her work,
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right? Um and uh um anyway, I my my neph
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my oldest nephew was just in town this past weekend and he started doing what
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he was doing and my brother and I looked at each other and went, “Are you kidding? That’s
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mom, right? Like it didn’t go anywhere now. Right now it’s And now those those
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pieces are being expressed through through my through my eldest nephew. My brother and I just had the biggest the
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biggest chuckle out of it. Like mom’s still here. Yes. And so coming back to this because there
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is this idea I just did a podcast with Juliana. I learned about this which was about intragenerational trauma. There is
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this idea that why do I have to you know like solve or why do I even have to
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carry this that is not mine. This is my point. It is yours. Your soul if you
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believe that we have a soul. I do believe that we have a soul is entangled is so let’s go back to your nephew. It’s
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not random why your nephew is connected to your mother. Exactly. Something about him something about his soul. Something
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about his whole being. Yes. Needs to embody that. Not because it belongs to your mom. It maybe it started with your
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mom. Yeah. But something about his purpose in life is so connected to that.
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So when people you know complain about why do I have to, you know, be responsible for what
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they did before, it’s because something about this is yours to own what is yours. It might not have started with
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you, but the fact that you’re expressing it, the fact that you are feeling it, the fact that you are expressing
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symptoms about it is because aspects of this are yours. Totally. And I can see
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that those pieces are connected to the work that my mom was also unable to
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complete. And you can almost see like what he wants to study and where he wants to go is almost yes meaningful for
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him. It’s part of his mission, but simultaneously there’s aspects of it that are going to be completing some of
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my mom’s work that it’s both. Yes. Yeah. It’s both. It’s both. We are connected
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to for a family system perspective. Even those that are deceased and are not here
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anymore, they’re still alive. The energy is still in the system. It’s just transformed. It’s expressing is being
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expressed in a different way. Yeah. So when we are working with kids, Yeah.
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working with all of these. Yeah, exactly. We Which I love I love that we’re naming that because I think in a
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lot of our training, we’re trained to isolate, right? So, we isolate this
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child and this child’s symptoms. And a lot of play therapists aren’t really
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trained through a systemic kind of a kind of a lens versus even this
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curiosity of what in this is meaningful for the child and what if this is also
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part of the larger system that’s being expressed through this child and we may
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not even totally ever know the answer to that but even just to be curious about that I think opens up possibility for
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the energy to move. Would you say that? Absolutely. Going back to, you know, I
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remember when we first started working together, Lisa, you will say this that that really stuck with me. You will say
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kids, so our kids, if I’m a parent, like my kids will express
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that that that I repress or that that I have a hard time to be in relationship with. And that is connected to the order
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of belonging. kids in our in the clinical space are going to express
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or are going to feel attracted to that that the parents have a really hard time
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to be in relationship with. Yeah. So as a therapist, if I’m not aware of
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this information, if of course not that there is one way, but I’m just going to invite you to start to get curious about
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if you have this idea in mind that the kids symptoms are also an expression of an
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uncomplete experience that the parents had or have
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in life. So how do we work with that?
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Totally. So, I’m gonna ask an interesting question, too, because you said um system isn’t just family. I know
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we said we’re going to focus on that, but Millie, I find the same thing in the relationship between the therapist and
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the child. Yes. So, if we’re just gonna plant a seed on that just that that
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equal curiosity. So not only um why you know what’s the wisdom in these symptoms
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for this whole family system but also what’s the wisdom in these symptoms for the therapist that’s working with that
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particular family and what is also being activated and mirrored as an incomplete
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within the therapist 100%. Which this connects you
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know the episode that we had about you know how our clients are mirrors. Yeah. when we talk about aggression, you know,
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what is going on for us, attachment to self. So, I wonder if it would be worth
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to just explore some of that, right? Like how these principles applied like I’m happy D wants to share how like when
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I discover SPT, SPT gave me the the the gift to come back here to find myself to
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find my own individuality. I come from a culture that we are all enshed and we’re
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all together and everything is in community. Right? So when I discover SPT, SPT was like wait there is a millie
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in all of this. there is you’re right like a way of um just coming back home
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and what family consolation is giving me is like a bigger lens around where I
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come from like the roots and and that’s why I see like how SPT and and family constellation do this
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they like come together and play together so well because it’s like I I I finally have like a a complete circle
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cycle right around those two places. Well, so let’s let’s explore this
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practically. We have a client that comes into the playroom who um is struggling
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with feeling like they are the adult in the relationship. Okay, so we can go in that one. And part of the magic of the
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play therapy process um and I again I can’t speak to all modalities but at least through an SPT lens is as this
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child gets an opportunity to attach themselves to discover what is true for them they also begin to discover their
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place. Yes. and and and where where they’re giving too much where they’re
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taking where they’re taking too much like as they right as as they start to
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find themselves in the context of which in which they
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exist and and you and I have well we’ve talked about this a lot in SPT training
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that um when one person in the system shifts the system shifts so even just
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the impact of as a child begins to discover what’s mine and what’s not
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mine. Gets to orient back into themsel and gets to begin to question, hey, is
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that my responsibility? I don’t know if that’s my responsibility to be taking care of my parent, right? Hold on a second. I’m five. I’m supposed to be
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take care of my teddy bear, right? Like that’s my responsibility, you know, right now. I gota work on picking up my
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toys, right? That’s my responsibility, not not, you know, caretaking my parent emotionally kind of a thing.
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Um the the my belief is that the impact of that inner discovery moves the
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system. Like how could there not be a shift in the system?
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Now sometimes the system can move with that and adapt. And I’ve also seen it
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where the system itself is so anchored into their positioning and their roles
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that the five-year-old sort of force isn’t enough to shift the whole system, right? The system sort of keeps the
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child locked into their role, but but that but it doesn’t still take away from
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the gift in this child continuing to grapple with and begin to make sense of
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who am I in this context? What feels right to me? How do I trust myself? How
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do I come back into connection with myself? Will you speak to that from a
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from the consolation perspective? I agree with you that many times the work that we do with the kids, it’s enough to
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initiate movement. Yeah. In the system. Other times as you say like the the the
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roles and the dynamics and the expectations are so ingrained so like h
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in one stuck in one place that that it’s not enough
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energ like a shock or something. Yeah. So like for me right so for many years I
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only work with the kid and in my opinion that was enough and I was able to see lots of changes as I changed in how I
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work I right now don’t imagine working with a kid without working with the parents because I truly love to see you
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know like I don’t know that’s my intensity like I like to see change from a different angle
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um but I think you know like if we go back to this idea that sometimes we don’t get to work with the system,
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right? Sometimes parents are not available. Sometimes um parents are not in the picture. The kid will experience
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with us what it feel what it feels like to explore that new role. Yep. That new
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place. Yeah. The kid will take with him or her or they them that sense. And
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maybe eventually they will get to to play that right in a different way. My
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experience is when I’m working with parents, what I love about these three
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ideas, these three orders is that usually one of these orders is not in place. Mhm. So for example, the
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parentified child clearly the kid is not in its place as a child and is being you
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know mom’s mom let’s say but what I even think about when I think from a
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generational perspective if the kid is being is playing out the mother’s role
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is because someone else is missing which it is grandma. Grandma like the mother’s
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p perception was that she didn’t have a mother. That’s why she’s attracting her son to be mom. So when I play when I
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work, you know, with with with families, I first work from a place of
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okay, there is always order. There’s always balance. But we know that sometimes the the balance that is being
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expressed in the system creates symptoms and that those symptoms are telling us, hey, maybe there is another way to be in
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relationship. Yeah. So what I am attracting in my work with families are parents that are more curious about
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this. Yeah. So instead of like labeling as okay the kid is being parentified and
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name that as you know this shouldn’t be like this right I get curious about okay
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what is the what is the purpose in this what is the function that the kid is
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being you know is playing in the system and then I get curious with the parents from a place of curiosity
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where I get to bring in by their dynamics their relationship with their
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parents like do when I do an intake from the beginning, they know that this is my lens, that I work from a systemic lens.
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Um, and I think that I I think families are open for
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this, but if you’re a therapist that you’re not trained in this and you don’t feel comfortable about this, you can
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still bring this lens into the work that you do with kids. Yep. Well, absolutely.
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Even even just the even just looking at in the in the in the work of what you’re
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doing in the playroom. I mean when we look at the points in the play where the
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child begins to I know in some models they call it show mastery right and others like in SPT we call overcoming
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the challenges you know others talk about empowerment others talk about you know all of the like there’s different
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names for it often times what you see in the play is the re is the are the three
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um uh sorry what did you call it the three the three the three orders right
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right so all of a sudden Then you see the baby doll or the baby being taken care of in the in the in the like proper
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structure or in the in the hierarchy that it wants to be taken care of it, right? Um you see you start to see the
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yeah you see the balance, right? You see um you see the balance of the of the of the given the take. And so I even think
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that whole lens is interesting from look when you’re looking at how do you know
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when the work is done in the playroom or how do you even start to track change in the play process or how do you start to
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see that a child is healing? You’re going to see the three orders begin to
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come into a different configuration. And what I’m hearing you say is that at least one will be out of place. Um but
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you could have all three out of place. Yes. Oh yeah, absolutely. And we tend to see when clients come to to us, my
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experience is that we tend to see at least two out of place because that’s where you see the most symptoms.
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Um but what the kid is so we know right that we just said this, right?
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the kid can experience this new order, if you will. And even if we don’t see
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huge changes in the system, the kid is creating a new template that makes sense
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to his perception of himself and to his perception of his system, right? Yep.
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Yes. Which which then at some they have something then to go after, right? It’s it’s in the there’s a
32:04
I mean, the research shows you just you need something to compare something to. Yes. Right. If you don’t have something
32:10
to compare something to, then you you don’t know that there’s some that there’s another option. And so sometimes
32:16
in the playroom, we’re offering something to compare the experience to. And even if the child can’t just move
32:23
into that in their current, you know, uh in their current system, well, they they
32:30
have another option in inside. Yes, they have an option. And when as therapists,
32:35
right, like these three orders, right, we also our orders also show up in the
32:41
relationship, right, with our clients. And we tend to have one of these orders
32:46
out of place. So for example, for me was the balance between giving and taking
32:51
for a long time. I was an overgiver because I had a hard time to take. When
32:58
you give too much is because you cannot take what is yours or what you feel that you deserve. So I will attract clients
33:05
that needed that. They needed that the therapies that went out of her way right
33:10
all the time and I had a really hard time setting limits with parents because
33:16
I was overgiving and right now I feel that I’m in a different place right but
33:21
that was my own journey in being able to find even that order in my family system. And so Millie, I’m just going to
33:28
name this. Um, as a play therapy system, we have this one out of order.
33:37
So play therapists in general have been trained or have been taught that it is
33:44
better to give than to receive. And uh, and it has resulted in a lot of play
33:51
therapists not being able to set B. I mean, if if someone’s struggling with boundaries, we know that there’s
33:57
something out of order in that particular one, right? Like not being able to set boundaries, not being able to charge what they’re worth. Yeah. Not
34:03
being able to charge what they’re worth, not being able to hold the line. Um, not
34:09
being able to deal with someone being mad or upset with them, you know, uh,
34:14
and I mean, all of those pieces which I think is really, really prevalent in our field. And also the belonging. I feel
34:21
that in our field there are some you know when we talked about aggression right that there’s not a lot of you know
34:30
acceptance or space to explore aggression in its full expression
34:36
right so I also think that and this also is connected to culture right some cultures are more comfortable with
34:42
certain emotions than other cultures right so I also think that belonging like are we really as therapists can we
34:49
and when we think about our window of tolerance right like can make space for all the emotions or are there certain
34:54
emotions that we exclude and that we put or certain profile of clients that we
35:00
exclude? I will never work with well there’s information there. You’re excluding something which is not, you
35:07
know, wrong or good. It’s just information around your own Yeah. history, your own narrative. Well, let’s
35:15
add another one too that a play therapist should look a particular way or should act a particular way. you know
35:22
the number of shoulds in our field for play therapists um also again I think go
35:28
into this idea around belonging like can I I think a question I think why SPT resonates for so many therapists is
35:35
exactly what you said at the beginning which is there was permission in there for you to belong like either belong to
35:42
a community belong within yourself find your you know find your place and so I
35:48
think that that question can can a therapist really be themselves in our field? That’s a really interesting
35:54
question. Is there is there truly permission? I would say no. I think it’s
36:01
very conditional. Uhhuh. Certain parts are very welcome. Other
36:06
parts are very uncomfortable and I think you know in our field we are turning into I feel that we’re moving into a
36:13
being very like politically correct. There are certain things you have to say as a therapist. There are certain
36:19
labels. There are certain things that you must name in order to belong.
36:24
I question all of that. Because we leave information out. We leave others out.
36:30
Yeah. Yeah. I’m gonna take a breath on that. too.
36:37
So Millie, what I’m what I’m hearing big picture is, well, first of all, listeners, if this is an exciting
36:43
conversation, go study family constellations, reach out to Millie. Millie does trainings for organizations
36:50
and all the presentations and all that. So you can also um reach out to Millie and get information there. Actually, as
36:58
I’m saying that, let’s throw out your website. Millie, where can people find you? Integrating Mundos is my my
37:04
website. If you type Millie Shoemaker, you’re going to find me. Great. And it also be in the show notes um as well. Um
37:12
but but beyond that, even if we’re not trained, what I’m appreciating is that
37:18
you are widening our lens, right? You’re you’re offering this beautiful invitation for us to think bigger than
37:25
what’s just directly in front of us and to and to really honor that what’s in
37:31
front of us has its tethers in so many different places. Part of it’s
37:37
meaningful for the client, part of it’s meaningful for the family and part of it’s meaningful also for the larger
37:43
family system, generations, ancestry, etc., etc. and that this um this child in front of
37:51
us is uh is is is really um how do I say
37:56
that? Because there’s a beauty that I’m that that I’m seeing and feeling that it’s I’m here like there’s an
38:01
opportunity in here within the child um for uh for their own growth for the
38:07
growth of the system itself. Um, and I that feels important to me because I
38:13
think sometimes when play therapists see the symptoms that the kids are creating
38:18
or they see or hear about what’s happening in the family system, they go right to judgment like, “Oh my goodness,
38:25
this is awful. This is the worst thing. This is a bad family system.” And and I’m just there’s like an invitation here
38:31
to look at the beauty of a family system. Yes. I don’t know if you want to add into
38:38
that or not, but that’s what I’m hearing. I I want to just I just had a session with a kid that I want to just
38:43
just share a little bit how this shows up in a very simple session. Yeah. So, I just had a session with a little girl.
38:50
She’s from Central America. Um and what the family excludes in my
38:56
opinion is beauty. Beauty is expressed in a very
39:01
um in one way which it is by woman having to use a lot of makeup, woman
39:07
having to her have their hair done, having to wear like specific
39:12
clothes. So what she did in the play through babies, she was playing with babies and she was very she was naming
39:20
about a particular baby that had a darker skin that she didn’t like that she needed to put makeup on it. She need
39:27
to put some lipstick. Right. So, it was all about like beauty is expressed in
39:32
one form. I’m holding that baby. And is my baby because she said she’s your
39:38
baby. Even though you’re lighter, you have a dark baby. Right. So, what I’m saying very intentional in my statements
39:44
is, “Oh, baby, you’re so beautiful just the way you are. You don’t need makeup,
39:50
you know, to feel beautiful. You don’t need, but if you want to, you can, right?” Like, so what I’m doing here,
39:56
I’m respecting the family’s values. I’m not challenging mom that she shouldn’t. She’s who she is, right? She wears a lot
40:03
of makeup and that’s okay, right? But she also chose a a therapist that looks different. I’m not the typical, you
40:10
know, um, Latina stereotype. I look a little bit different. And what I’m doing
40:15
in that session is including different types of beauty,
40:21
right? And then the kid gets to experience that, right? Gets to experience, well, I don’t always have to
40:28
wear makeup. I don’t always have to look good with my hair or I can just love myself for who I am and not always for
40:35
the way that I look, right? So that order of belonging, right, is a simple
40:40
order that shows up in the play by what the family is excluding and how important it is as a therapist to not
40:47
judge it. Yeah. But just go with it and be creative around showing another way
40:52
so the kid has different options at the end of the day. That’s it. That’s all doing. Yep. So they can figure out
40:59
what’s true for them. Totally. And and what belonging means for them.
41:04
Yes. Yeah. Play it out and practice and see what you know what feels true to
41:10
them. And that that is a life h journey process, right? It takes, you know, it
41:15
took me many years to be comfortable in my own skin and just be okay with who I am. So, it’s just, you know, like I
41:22
don’t know, I just like to see it from this perspective and just just know that we are what we’re doing influence, but
41:29
at the end of the day, they go back to their system in my opinion and that’s where they belong and that’s is is also
41:37
meaningful the system that they are part of. Yeah, there’s wisdom. There’s so much wisdom and wisdom in the system. So
41:46
much wisdom. And who am I to say that that kid should be with someone else? I
41:52
could never do that job because I see I see wisdom and love wherever I go.
41:58
Yeah. Yeah. Beautiful. Beautiful. Beautiful. Well, everyone, I hope you found that as interesting as I
42:06
did. I love talking to you about this stuff, Millie. It’s so fun.
42:12
Um Millie, any final final thoughts here as we wrap up? Just get curious about
42:17
your orders? Get curious about, you know, I don’t know what that that you tend to judge and, you know, h that you
42:25
don’t want in your life is what you tend to is where your work is. My invitation to get curious about that. Yeah.
42:32
Beautiful. Well, everyone, wherever you are in the world,
42:39
um, take care of yourself. You are the most important toy in the playroom.
42:45
Until next time, everyone.
